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  • Lumpy idle due to carbonised spark plugs

    Hi all,

    Im sure someone on here can advise me on this....please

    My wifes THP 155 has done only 12000 miles (63 plate) and already its showing signs of carbon build-up. Its been to Citroen and they have said that it needs driving harder, to put Super Uleaded in it one every 4 or 5 times we fill up and then see how it goes.

    Background: The car went into melt down and broke down on the motorway about 2 months ago and a sensor was swapped - it said "OVERHEATING - STOP!!" on the dashboard. Two weeks later a recall went out for owners to get their sensors checked. Everything was OK up until this point (from new until about 1 year 16 months old) although it was a bit 'lumpy' form time to time. It had trouble starting etc sometimes. I thought this was a build up to the sensor fault or the sensor was messing up the mixes making it run badly.. Maybe two different issues or maybe they are related I dont know.

    Once the sensor was swapped, it was still lumpy so it went back in to Citroen and they cleaned up the spark plugs. 6 weeks has gone by and we took it in again for being lumpy on idle. They said its all clean excep the spark plugs needed cleaning again and its then they advised on better using better fuel and revving it more.

    I understand from reading other posts that its a 'dry' style engine and so you get build up of carbon in the air intakes etc., but will using better fuel make any difference to the spark plugs and stop them gumming up?

    I am by no means a car buff by any stength of the imagination...I know they have 5 wheels .....but I did question citroen and they said the air intakes were clean. It seems it IS just the spark plugs that have the issues, or at least thats what they tell me.

    I can only go on what they advise, but its got a year left on the 3 yr deal and I was thinking of buying it at the end of the term, but this issue is becoming a bit of a pain in the bum so Im not sure at the moment. Its better financially to buy it, but only if I can stop it going lumpy all the time.

    I have read about jamie and walnut blasting etc., but it doesnt seem that we're at that stage yet.

    So really what Im asking is...shoud I.
    1 - Just use super unleaded all the time, or use it just some of the time as Citroen have said.
    2 - Rev the car more (my wife does keep the revs under 4000rpm generally and only does 20 min journeys to work and 20 mins back, although that does include some motorway). Will this make a difference or just wear other parts out quicker.
    3 - If the car is left being lumpy e.g. dirty spark plugs - does this damage the car? Will it enventually breakdown again, or does it just reduce power and mpg as the car cant 'breathe'

    Ultimately I wasnt to know how to stop the spark plugs becoming a problem every six weeks, and if what Citroen have said will actually make any difference or not.

    Any advise greatly appreciated.

    Cheers,

  • #2
    1. I've run both my THP 155s on V-Power (or super unleaded if no V-Power available).
    2. I definitely redline my current one regularly and did with my previous too.
    3. No idea sorry, I'm sure someone with more knowledge (Jamie) will be along shortly.

    I've never (touch wood) had any issues with either car, whether that is down to the fuel, my driving or complete luck is a mystery to me.

    It sounds like you're still within warranty though, so for now it's down to Citroen to fix any issues you have.
    - DS3 DSport Plus - THP 155 - Belle-ile Blue with Perla Nera Black Roof -
    - DS3Club Discord -

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    • #3
      The way I see it is the spark plugs getting Fouled as a symptom of the carbon building up on the valves screwing up the mixture in the cylinder, (not getting enough air for the amount of fuel).
      Originally posted by cyclone
      It is in the handbook. Satisfied.
      Originally posted by Broda
      I would rather teabag a bear trap

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      • #4
        Originally posted by BeefMasta View Post
        1. I've run both my THP 155s on V-Power (or super unleaded if no V-Power available).
        2. I definitely redline my current one regularly and did with my previous too.
        3. No idea sorry, I'm sure someone with more knowledge (Jamie) will be along shortly.

        I've never (touch wood) had any issues with either car, whether that is down to the fuel, my driving or complete luck is a mystery to me.

        It sounds like you're still within warranty though, so for now it's down to Citroen to fix any issues you have.
        Hi Beefmasta

        When you say you red line it regularly, how often is that? Are we talking once per trip, once per day, one per week.....all the time?? Just wondering.

        Cheers

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Kam View Post
          Hi Beefmasta

          When you say you red line it regularly, how often is that? Are we talking once per trip, once per day, one per week.....all the time?? Just wondering.

          Cheers
          I only really drive it on weekends (I walk to work), but I would say at least a few times a journey (once the engine is warm), depending on the trip. I do a lot of motorway miles so it's usually just down the slip roads, 1st, 2nd & 3rd get a good work out (up to the legal speed limit officer).

          My previous DS3 was 2 years old and had 23995 when I traded it in, current one is on around 17500 since June 2014. I'm not planning on trading it in until at least the end of my Elect3 (June 2017) but based on comments on here I'm probably going to take it to Jamie for a blasting around June next year.
          - DS3 DSport Plus - THP 155 - Belle-ile Blue with Perla Nera Black Roof -
          - DS3Club Discord -

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          • #6
            Even when Jamie had mine in for a walnut blast, I never had carbon build up on the plugs. Did you actually see this or is just what the dealership said.

            I'm sure Jamie has mentioned that he has seen significant build up on engine with a few at 10k miles on the clock so 12k with normal fuel may indicate excessive carbon deposits. Also a 'lumpy' engine on idle might be down to a faulty High Pressure Fuel Pump, both myself and Jamie experienced rough idle on our original HPFP's, something that was cured when the latest revision was installed.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Superfly Guy View Post
              Even when Jamie had mine in for a walnut blast, I never had carbon build up on the plugs. Did you actually see this or is just what the dealership said.

              I'm sure Jamie has mentioned that he has seen significant build up on engine with a few at 10k miles on the clock so 12k with normal fuel may indicate excessive carbon deposits. Also a 'lumpy' engine on idle might be down to a faulty High Pressure Fuel Pump, both myself and Jamie experienced rough idle on our original HPFP's, something that was cured when the latest revision was installed.
              Hi,

              No, I didnt actually see it, Im going by what Citroen told me to be honest. It gets toa stage where it struggles to start up, maybe once a week to begin, then twice a week etc., and the lumpiness begins on idle. I wonder how I can pursuade Citroen to look at the HPFP as its still under warranty until Sept 2016.

              So you think using the premium fuel should help?

              Thanks

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Kam View Post
                Hi,

                No, I didnt actually see it, Im going by what Citroen told me to be honest. It gets toa stage where it struggles to start up, maybe once a week to begin, then twice a week etc., and the lumpiness begins on idle. I wonder how I can pursuade Citroen to look at the HPFP as its still under warranty until Sept 2016.

                So you think using the premium fuel should help?

                Thanks
                Also, when you say 'latest revision of HPFP', when was that released. Our car is on a 63 plate, so was it after this?

                Thanks

                Comment


                • #9
                  The debate over normal supermarket style fuel and premium 'V' Power stuff rages on and on, I'm personally going with those who work directly in the trade who recommend higher octane fuel.

                  Ref the HPFP, my car is an early 2010 model which was running the original revision pump. Jamie replaced it with the latest version which I think is common to the JCW Mini.

                  I would have thought your garage would have at least looked at the HPFP as these symptoms have previously been attributed to older versions of the pump. Also carbon build up can be delayed by fuel type and driving style but once its there its there, physical removal is the only guaranteed solution.
                  Last edited by Superfly Guy; 16-10-2015, 10:04.

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                  • #10
                    I have an 2011 1.6thp...is it normal to have 700 RPM at idle when engine is warm? Or what idle speed is recommended by manufacturer? Thanks.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Barola View Post
                      I have an 2011 1.6thp...is it normal to have 700 RPM at idle when engine is warm? Or what idle speed is recommended by manufacturer? Thanks.
                      Sounds ok as long as it is stable and not bouncing up and down. I think cold start idle is about 1200 rpm and then drops as it warms up.
                      ///DStyle+ VTi 120 in white/black/red ///
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                      • #12
                        Yes, 700rpm is target idle speed when warm. Can rise slightly if battery needs a bit of charge.
                        White on red THP
                        Miltek exhaust with HKS highflow cat, Forge intercooler, hard pipe kit, induction kit, oil catch tank, , VAG BOV, Stage 3 SPT remap 217 BHP

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                        • #13
                          Thanks Jamie and BenS for the help. I was thinking that low idle rpm was the reason for my very low jiddery/lumpy idle...but will have to seek more for the solution that is getting me crazy after all the work done with inlet cleaning, decarbonization, injector cleaning, lambda sensor change to new, new HPFP pump...

                          Could be that after all chemistry work I have successfully managed only to destroy new NGK spark plugs

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